tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post2236221035461290190..comments2023-10-10T04:30:38.687-05:00Comments on Deo volente: Tenure as a social contractDave Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09100006856645294730noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-74748167126837265922011-09-26T12:23:11.850-05:002011-09-26T12:23:11.850-05:00Yeah. So far Google's spam filter has caught 0...Yeah. So far Google's spam filter has caught 0% of the four or five spam comments we've attracted, while misfiling at least twice as many genuine comments as spam. The flurry of spam last night leads me to fear that the flurry of real comments of late has made the site more attractive to spammers: we'll see. They do provide a bit of comic relief. <br /><br />Who will be the first to Dave Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09100006856645294730noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-63184938837022242252011-09-26T08:11:20.389-05:002011-09-26T08:11:20.389-05:00Looks like you've got some spam at 2:17 AM.Looks like you've got some spam at 2:17 AM.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-27364255876927782972011-09-25T14:29:00.852-05:002011-09-25T14:29:00.852-05:00Jon Bean, the FA works as democratically as it can...Jon Bean, the FA works as democratically as it can within Illinois law. As you know, there are lots of different ways of doing democracy. Illinois law allows the faculty to elect to be represented by a union and then allows individuals to elect not to join that union, thereby surrendering their right to directly influence its actions. Not an ideal system from either the labor or management Dave Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09100006856645294730noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-84364129537869573732011-09-25T13:10:26.806-05:002011-09-25T13:10:26.806-05:00Jonathan Gray,
Actually, as I understand it. You...Jonathan Gray,<br /><br />Actually, as I understand it. You are simply wrong regarding your assertion that faculty not in agreement with the FA could organize an alternative to the FA. <br /><br />The Illinois Education Labor Relations Act, as it currently stands, grants the FA/IEA **exclusive** representation of SIU T/TT faculty. No other group(s) are legally allowed to represent anyone. TheAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-42952813064571819722011-09-25T12:39:49.438-05:002011-09-25T12:39:49.438-05:00@8:25 PM,
My department does have some faculty wi...@8:25 PM,<br /><br />My department does have some faculty with higher teaching or service loads because they are no longer engaged in research. It is not a prefect solution. I'd like to see more efforts into helping people re-engage. This is something worth working with the admin on but is not a part of the current contract dispute.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-18744104916460289122011-09-25T12:07:19.674-05:002011-09-25T12:07:19.674-05:00"I am a member of the FA, and I don't alw..."I am a member of the FA, and I don't always agree with their positions, either. But that is not really the point in a representative democracy, is it?"<br /><br />Unlike the government, this "democratic" organization (FA) doesn't claim to rule with the consent of all the governed. In fact, it is a minority party, although it garnered a majority vote 13 years ago--whenJonathan Beannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-51716331183434039802011-09-25T11:44:56.008-05:002011-09-25T11:44:56.008-05:00I am a member of the FA, and I don't always ag...I am a member of the FA, and I don't always agree with their positions, either. But that is not really the point in a <i>representative</i> democracy, is it? <br /><br />Moreover, it is conceivable that if this "silent majority" is really a majority and united in more than their silence, they could organize their own group (with no dues?) to challenge the authority of the FA to Jonathan Graynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-56340196584955951152011-09-25T10:53:11.027-05:002011-09-25T10:53:11.027-05:00I think it is a mistake to believe that the appare...I think it is a mistake to believe that the apparent surge in comments opposing the FA is coming from administrators. Seems a little paranoid, perhaps:-)<br /><br />I agree that emotions are building (on both sides) and I think the rhetoric is simply a reflection of that. People who thought this was all sabre rattling and negotiating posturing had who been hoping that this would be sorted out Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-43577985230826649392011-09-25T10:39:06.429-05:002011-09-25T10:39:06.429-05:00Anonymous 10:09 - Perhaps I should qualify that. ...Anonymous 10:09 - Perhaps I should qualify that. I have to pay the FA $600 per year to have a voice in this matter. Since I'm not willing to do that (because (1) the parent organization profits from strife on campus and (2) I don't agree with FA tactics and viewpoints on many topics), I have no control over a possible strike. This does not make me an administrator. People reading and Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-32828644147152966482011-09-25T10:09:01.465-05:002011-09-25T10:09:01.465-05:00Anonymous 9:11, How can you say you "have no ...Anonymous 9:11, How can you say you "have no control over" a possible strike? You have had (and continue to have) the ability to join the FA, NTT FA, ACeS, or GAU and vote accordingly. You can also organize others who feel the same way and have them do the same. Unions are one of the last truly democratic institutions.<br /><br />The only way you have no control over this is if youreAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-42659631946123948722011-09-25T09:33:00.645-05:002011-09-25T09:33:00.645-05:00Anonymous (9:11 AM):
It's not the number of c...Anonymous (9:11 AM):<br /><br />It's not the number of comments that makes me believe they are from administrators, it's the style. Up until the last week, the anti-FA comments have, like yours, generally been on-topic and reasonable. <br /><br />This week, some of the new comments have been off-topic and name calling. I try to dismiss that kind of comment (pro- or con-) regardless of whoparanoidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01305552154248972937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-18517239717626052372011-09-25T09:11:50.173-05:002011-09-25T09:11:50.173-05:00Could it also be that the number of anti-FA commen...Could it also be that the number of anti-FA comments is directly related to the fact that the FA is calling for a strike vote. Those of us that are speaking out (with anti-FA comments) may be affected by a strike that we have no control over and do not want. It is easy for you to dismiss us by calling us administrators (or administration supporters), but we also have a lot riding on this.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-74792765425256522672011-09-25T09:06:17.609-05:002011-09-25T09:06:17.609-05:00Anonymous (6:50 PM):
The surge in anti-FA comment...Anonymous (6:50 PM):<br /><br />The surge in anti-FA comments this week has me wondering about Administrators jumping in here this week too. I don't think Anonymous 8:25 PM is an administrator. The comments don't have the same ring as the new ones. <br /><br />Anonymous 8:25 PM et al.'s comments address something in Dave's post or in the comment chain. Anonymous 8:25 PM doesn'paranoidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01305552154248972937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-6560265560095699342011-09-25T07:56:11.436-05:002011-09-25T07:56:11.436-05:00Anonymous 6:50 is typical of how comments on this ...Anonymous 6:50 is typical of how comments on this blog are often misunderstood. I'm not an administrator and I'm not working on behalf of an administrator. In fact, I'm a tenured faculty member in a CoLA department. Disagreement with you (or the FA for that matter) doesn't make me an administrator! Thanks for the early morning laugh though.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-87748823738190351642011-09-25T06:50:04.993-05:002011-09-25T06:50:04.993-05:00It appears the anonymous 8:25 PM and 9:45PM is eit...It appears the anonymous 8:25 PM and 9:45PM is either an administrator or negotiating on this blog on behalf of an administrator. Any faculty member, who knows what tenure means, would not make such comments.<br />SIUC is going downhill faster than what you may think. Many good people have left and many are looking forward to leaving.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-46841879110382547682011-09-24T23:09:19.723-05:002011-09-24T23:09:19.723-05:00To the best of my knowledge, nothing in the contra...To the best of my knowledge, nothing in the contract forbids chairs form assigning 12 hours of teaching per semester--so long as there is then no service or research load. There is obviously some variety between departments. My department routinely has a 3/2 load, for example, and we teach lots of four credit hour courses; so I and many of my peers taught 17 credit hours last year while those onDave Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09100006856645294730noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-21484784348040678592011-09-24T21:45:32.529-05:002011-09-24T21:45:32.529-05:00I would certainly be opposed to tenure being revok...I would certainly be opposed to tenure being revoked, but what about changing responsibilities? For example, it would seem reasonable to me that a non-productive faculty member be made to teach 4/4 instead of 2/2? Is this currently possible? Would the FA be opposed to this type of agreement? <br /><br />I also think that tenure at SIUC comes pretty easily compared to top-tier research Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-38378587698693461762011-09-24T21:05:43.213-05:002011-09-24T21:05:43.213-05:00Last time around, the administration wanted post-t...Last time around, the administration wanted post-tenure review. My understanding is that the FA was willing to discuss the concept, but had a rather different understanding of what such a review could consist of than the administration did. <br /><br />Tenured faculty can of course already be reviewed (as we are for merit pay and for promotion to Full Professor) and can even be dismissed, where Dave Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09100006856645294730noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-35237909380154431142011-09-24T20:25:42.254-05:002011-09-24T20:25:42.254-05:00Dave - You state that faculty "uphold our sid...Dave - You state that faculty "uphold our side of the tenure system" and while this is often true, there are faculty that earn tenure and then become burdens to their units, colleges, and universities when they decide that teaching (and often teaching poorly) is their only professional responsibility. This is why I think that any contractual protection of tenure should be accompanied Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3492014659405332380.post-59016556523816165302011-09-24T16:00:08.846-05:002011-09-24T16:00:08.846-05:00Some of the above rings true but the "you cou...Some of the above rings true but the "you could expect a new line" for granted doesn't jibe with my experience in 17 years at SIUC. No one should ever let such considerations color their view of a candidate's merit. <br /><br />If those judging T&P are so cynical to think "we can't lose this position," the tenure process surely is broken. <br /><br />Frankly, Jonathan Beannoreply@blogger.com